9:37 PM me: you watching the DNC?
9:38 PM am8v: yeah, you?
 me: yeah
9:39 PM I feel bad for these people
 am8v: which people
 me: but they are so ignorant
 am8v: who?
9:40 PM me: the people speaking
  all these citizens
	20 minutes
10:00 PM me: you a mccain or obama man?
  by the way mccain VEEE PEEE choice tomorrow morning
10:02 PM am8v: yeah, so i hear
  obama 08 over here
  if i have to choose
  but i would align myself as an indepnedent
  but nobody cares about them lol
 me: haha
10:03 PM am8v: you?
 me: i don't see the difference between them
 am8v: ???how?
 me: name some differences
  that will actually happen
 am8v: well,
  theres is no way i can predict if theyll happen tho
10:04 PM me: sure you can
  US signed pact
 am8v: maybe by the votes
 me: says out of iraq by 2011
  unconditional
  neither is that knowledgeable on the economy, taxes will go up for everyone no matter what
10:05 PM universal health care wont happen, but both want similar reform to make it cheaper
  both are kinda tree huggers
  abortion will continue to debate forever
  education is a difference but all I see happening is more of the same shit
10:06 PM am8v: honestly, you cant predict
  the us signs things left and right
  it doesnt really matter; e.g., north korea still on terror list
 me: yeah but coallition and nato signed too
  so were all alone on it too
  plus
  obama wants out
  mccain said out by 2013
  so basically same in my mind
10:07 PM worst damage is alrready done anyway
 am8v: not really
  mccain votes 95% with bush
 me: 90
  but that's not that bad
 am8v: 95 most recently
 me: everyone says with bush
  but really
10:08 PM its what bush HASNT done that fucked us
  he promisded us humble foreign policy
  he reversed = fuckup
  he said good energy policy
  nope
 am8v: what you don't do is reflected by how you vote
 me: tax cuts = did it
  and economic success after 9/11
10:09 PM Democratic/Liberal ideas are a contaigious disease
  they sound good
  "were going to lower your taxes, giver you this, give you that, blah blah blah"
  but you just cant do it
10:10 PM am8v: we're run by politicans, thats the way it will most likely be for a long time, and its pretty certain that obama is lesser of two evils if you think about it
 me: fed govt should run military
  and that's about it
 am8v: plus, bush maybe not be the smartest, but the people he surrounds himself with, like mccain is dangerous
 me: states can run roads, regulations, laws
  local govt same
  that's it
  if we did that
  you know how much better it would be?
10:11 PM you cant blame bush for last 8 years
  some of it yes
  but some no
  look at clinton in the 90s
 am8v: the state already controls highways and such
 me: he did nothing
  NOTHING
 am8v: its not bush himself
  its the administration
 me: fed dot controls interstates, etc
10:12 PM but clinton just crossed his fingers for 8 years
  and rode a 1400% economic increase
  mainly thanks to regan
 am8v: even if the federal government controls roads
10:13 PM thats a small part of running the country
  @ the tax giveaway
  killed the federal budget
10:14 PM the bush administration is messy and doesnt know whats it doing
 me: http://www.wallstats.com/deathandtaxes/framing.html
10:15 PM am8v: thats clearly reflected w/ the way they handlded katrina (dropping traiilers in flood zones), 6 billion a month for iraq. etc
 me: its mismanagment
  but its because these organizations are seldom used
10:16 PM eg: military
  had no idea how to fight insurgents
  kicked iraqs ass in reg war in a week
  fema
  katrina
  it had never been that bad
 am8v: bush let michael brown run fema
  guy had no clue what he was doing
 me: http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/graphics_at2.shtml?5day?large#contents
10:17 PM am8v: the only way to judge a candidate is to see how they vote, and hope they continue that
 me: by the way cat 4 hurricane headed for new orleans
 am8v: lol thats unfortunate
 me: Ihonestly really don't care how it ends up
 am8v: you should though
 me: neither really has anything that I really like
  except mccain with his energy policy
 am8v: we're the people that are getting hurt the most when we grow up
10:18 PM me: were already fucked
 am8v: if we vote the right way, we'd be in less trouble
 me: romney was the only one going for our generation
  think of it this way
  if you have cadidate x and y
  x you agreee with on all or close to all issues
10:19 PM but don't think they can deliver
  candidate y and you agreee on some/most issues
  but you think they can make things happen
  who ynnagoing to vote for
 am8v: well, the quesiton is
10:20 PM how do you know the candidate "might or will" deliver
 me: well
  ex is obama
  with universal health care
  it just wont happen
10:21 PM bottom line is this
  Im still dissapointed
  waiting for someone with
  good energy policy reform
  massive monetary policy reform
 am8v: how do you know obams plan wont work
 me: foreign policy that makes sense
  less govt
 am8v: a HUGE revolution won't occur unless something drastic occurs
 me: universal health care simply wont work
10:22 PM think about it
 am8v: like an invasion on our soil
  people won't be in that mindset
 me: big pharma and healthcare is multi-billion dollar indutries
  all those jobs and revenues lost
  and then people have to pay more!
10:23 PM am8v: yeah, thats more on honesty though
 me: besides vaccines and school-mandated checkups
 am8v: corruption and big business is a different issue
 me: I havent been to the doc for an illness since age 6
 am8v: romney wasnt for us either
 me: 10 fucking year
  s
 am8v: you're an exception
 me: I wouldn't want to pay thopse year
  s
 am8v: romney flip flopped
10:24 PM wanted to increase military spending
 me: that's ok
  military spending is money well never regret spending
 am8v: outsource our jobs
  except that it would double our debt
  and we need money from foreign countries now
 me: were already in too deep
10:25 PM national public debt will always exist
  its just internationalal debt
  and sovreinty
 am8v: debt doesnt have to always exist
  its just that we're so used to it we've resigned ourselves to this state forever
 me: you cant pay off $10 trillion
 am8v: it'll take a long time
  but you can.
 me: its no longer about how much in numbers
  its about percent of GDP
10:26 PM look at japan
  their def is like 900 trillion yen
10:27 PM am8v: they shouldnt be our role models though
 me: even with fiscal responsibilty
 am8v: recession
 me: without about a 50% tax rate
  we can barely even afford to service the debt
 am8v: if we didnt spend 6 billion every month on iraq
  that might help a bit
10:28 PM and plus, japan survives on low interest rates
 me: wed waste it here on medicare
  plus
  govt cant control outsourcing
  that's corp choice
10:29 PM am8v: the gov't already controls the coporations
 me: only by high taxes
  that's why they leave
  and every time we reduce the deficit
  we go into recession
10:30 PM am8v: the only way to get, the way i see it
  is to make the country built on higher wages
  gradual so it isnt inflaiton
10:31 PM its not easy, outsourcing is also a probllem
 me: americans have to lower their standards
  weve been on an all you can eat do what you want lifestyle we cant afford
  and now foreign investment has to foot the bill
10:32 PM and buy us out
 am8v: exactly, a change in the way we think is very important too
 me: us will be up and down for a while
  at least 50 years
  with markets especially drving the game
  people will have to rough it out
 am8v: we have to cut costs, tax the higher class and tax the lower classes less
  yeah, its gonna be hard
 me: you cant tax high class more
10:33 PM and poor have to be taxed more
  they get a free ride
  they pay nothing
  and get everything
 am8v: the higher class is gonna have to sadly take a beating for a while if you want to close the gap
10:34 PM the reason we have poverty (i know i'm overgenarlizing)
 me: yeah
  you cant do that
  because
  they wont want that
 am8v: is because of education, housing
 me: they'llsay
  fuck this
  any other country will let us be rich
  Im out
10:36 PM am8v: yeah, thats true
  maybe we're done
 me: no
10:37 PM were not done
  its just extremely complex
  you can solve every issue
  you just need to figure out how to tell the people
 am8v: the kind of solutions that you're thinking about requires a massive overhaul
  we have to start all over
 me: "listen the fuck up - we know how to handle this, we got it, trust us, and back the fuck off for say...5 or 10 years)
10:38 PM and hope they listen
  and you can do it
 am8v: theres a very slim chance that people will accept that
 me: iraq:L get out
  energy: nuclear!!!
  lower taxes
  kill social programs
 am8v: i think...
  the country is basically done for then.
 me: moneyL gold standard
10:39 PM am8v: once again, that requires radical thinking
  a radical leader would never get into the oval office
  and even if we do need radical change, there are way too many special interest groups
  everybody looking out for themselves
 me: its doable
10:40 PM they have before
 am8v: the people would have to be brainwashed
  when?
 me: look how these programs started
  fucking FDR
  those dumbasses let him in 4 times?
  fuck four more years...four more terms
 am8v: fdr essentialy created trusts
10:41 PM me: fdr essentially fucked us forever
 am8v: trusts that own all the money + industries
  so maybe its been done before, but it wasnt positive
  i don't want to sound like an anarchist or anything, but theres honestly little hope for us
  too many big mistakes
10:42 PM me: yeah but its still possible
  Obama is a good start
  Ill give you that
  hes got the right idea
 am8v: :p lol
  thats why i support him
 me: just not the issues
  think of this
  mccain wants 100 new nuc plants
  we could do that
  and have all that energy
  clean
  cheap
  renewable
10:43 PM and all those jobs
  plus industry
  if we go now
  China, India, Japan
  they will all need a lot of power soon
  we can export parts to them
 am8v: mccain does want nuclear, but he would allow oil companies to drill wherever they want
10:44 PM where as obama suppots 150 billion over the next 10 years
  for alternative energy (wind, electricity)
 me: wind and solar duck
  my friends mom is head of central hudson
  he told me how bad wind and solar are
  nuclear is fine
  IMO
10:45 PM am8v: wind and solar maybe arent as effective
  but if executed on the scale obama is proposing
  it can work
  if wind and solar really sucked, we'd be seeing it in the news
 me: its so ineffieicent
  no
  because its a huge markey
  *market
10:46 PM how can investors make more money
  they KNOW that fed govt will buy into alternative
  wind and solar seem easier
  than nucleanr
  less controversy
 am8v: scientiifc studies are done
 me: but less efficent
 am8v: those studies arent influenced by poltiics, generally
 me: so they'llmake more money on solar and wind and ethanol
10:47 PM and I think Obama really is a little dumbfounded on what to do
  they pretty much proved he wasnt ready
10:48 PM they always said hes too broad and stuff
 am8v: how so?
 me: nobody bought it
  and then they ask him gas policy
  he says to inflate your tires
  thats not policy
10:49 PM am8v: yeah, maybe that wasn't the smartest thing to say
  that doesn't reflect his policy
10:50 PM me: but he never backed it up
  he has no policy on it
 am8v: its not like mccain never something stupid
 me: hes just says
  invest in green tech
  very generic
  yeah but his mistakes are like iraq borders pakistan haha
 am8v: http://my.barackobama.com/page/content/newenergy
  lol, imo mccain makes a lot more stupid mistakes when talking
10:51 PM me: Enact a Windfall Profits Tax to Provide a $1,000 Emergency Energy Rebate to American Families.
 am8v: he has his plans
 me: wheres that $$ going to come from?
 am8v: he may be vague in his "inspiration" speeches
 me: and why cant we tap our oil?
  our oil is like me telling you
  hey mike
  Ive got everything you need for 60 years
10:52 PM by the end of 60 years, youll need to find something else
 am8v: thats why we need to start early
  and find other sources
 me: and you might need some help for a few year now
  but for a good 50-60 years
  I can supply you with everything you need
  but
  if you want, you can find something else now
  and need help until you find it
10:53 PM and all those 60 years will be gone
  it only makes sense to rough it out now
  we can get oil out of the ground by end of 2010
  and then use that as needed
  but set benchmarks to be off it
  lets just say
  hypothetically
10:54 PM am8v: thats fine with me, if we have a timetable, unlike iraq
 me: we have enough oil for until 2100
  lets rough it until we tap it
  and by 2050
  be pretty much off it
  and by 2075 off it totally
  and the rest we export as profit
10:55 PM everything is possible
  think about it
  1950
  socially we were fucked
  now were practically perfect
  nobody would have dreamed
10:56 PM am8v: theres way too many little variables to account for
  but what you said i agree with
10:57 PM it seems more obama than mccain supportive though
 me: I don't know
  as I said
  I really don't support either
  I think Ill be surprised either way with what happens
  and rough it out
  but I think weve outlined everything needed to save america
  in about an hour
  how old are you?
  15?
10:58 PM am8v: yeah, that was constructive lol
 me: im 15...
  so in 20 years
  Peabody Lei 2038
  *2028
 am8v: ftw.
  its too bad we were born during a crisis period
 me: how can they counter us
  "we saved america at age 15"
 am8v: assassination?
10:59 PM me: what do you mean too young?
 am8v: lol, yeah
 me: haha
  cancell medicare, medicaid, social security
  take all the leftover money
  spread it out even
  and say
  well
  you lost a little
  but you saved everyone forever
11:00 PM am8v: yeah, the power must be tempting
11:01 PM you're not on mobile are you?
 me: no